Curse

Midnight Scorpion · May 13, 2005, 04:54 AM // 04:54

I rather like the Henchman most of the time compared to some rather uber-unintelligent players that I have seen on pick-up teams. I henched my way all the way to Ring of Fire, including Thunderhead Keep. After that I had to team though, henchies just can't stand up to the power of the Mursaat and Jade

Athryn · May 13, 2005, 05:03 AM // 05:03

I HATE Alesia. She is NOT a tank, now somebody tell her that. She uses like 1/10th as many heals as I would if I were a healer, and is generally a nuisance.

And whoever mentioned the henches playing smarter after Yak's Bend, no. They might have better skills that allow them to be more effective, but they are still really stupid. Once I got to Kryta, they were about 3-4 levels lower than most players, and that's not good.

What REALLY pisses me off is that the monsters seem to be so much smarter than the henches. While Alesia pretends she's a warrior and Little Thom runs around in circles in the distance, the monsters all gang up on me and kill me real quick. And then Alesia, instead of rezzing me, decides to try to avenge my death by meleeing the enemy.

I hate that stupid healer SO much.

Bone_White_Haze · May 13, 2005, 05:22 AM // 05:22

The henchmen are twitchy to be sure...but hey, they got me through to the River when several (miserably bad) pickup teams failed. Unbelievably bad night in the finding competent players department, solved by good old reliable Meatshield and his Merry Band.

Ever have the situation where the henchies and critturs are standing (literally) inches apart, and somehow can't see each other? Not stupid Stephen facing the wrong way while the healer's getting massacred--that happens every mission. But the whole bloody lot of them, and a mess of monsters, standing around like it's a bad ****tail party they can't wait to leave.

Odd thing is, it's like the AI is 'stuck'. I can attack, blast as many critturs as I want, and still they don't wake up (until you run short on mana, that always stirs them from their slumber)

But earlier this evening I had the Classic Mexican Standoff--this one is wild.

Half of the party (including self) is examing the grass in a face down position. Three henchies are left, facing a boss and a couple of grunts.

Stephen can't do more than dink the boss, who heals every other action. Alesia's going heal heal heal heal on Stevie. Boss+grunt can swat Steve hard enough to hurt him, but can't overcome the healing. Archer's plinking away at minions, they're plinking back, both catch a heal every time their health dips briefly.

This went on for ten minutes. Alicia can turn the tide of the battle completely by raising any nearby corpse (but no, she's gotta keep Steve at 100%, 90% is too dangerous!) Archer or Steve can (likely) break the standoff by switching targets--but nope, never happens. Minion could decide Steve or the healer is a tastier target--nope, never happens.

Bosses, minions, and Henchmen NEVER run out of juice. Ever. Must be nice.

So I bugged after ten minutes I bugged it and discoed, or it would likely *still* be going on.

Navaros · May 13, 2005, 08:13 AM // 08:13

i shall add to the almost-unanimous consensus that henchmen are indeed extremely mentally deficient (they were in the betas also) and really need to be worked on hardcore by the devs (many many hours of work, no doubt)

Deagol · May 13, 2005, 08:58 AM // 08:58

I will then to the minority oppinion that the henches are way smarter than the average random team of human players.

And I'm probably the only one for whom Alesia don't tank. She do ranged attacks, but that is not tanking. All the mobs attack her though, and defending her often become the primary tactic when playing with henches.

I do believe she will get herself in a lot of trouble if she tries to keep some of the human I have played with alive...

Tormunda · May 13, 2005, 09:21 AM // 09:21

I get no issues with the henchies at all. Some NPC's have got stuck, like Prince Roland on an early map, but the henchies give me no problems.

Mercury Angel · May 13, 2005, 10:55 AM // 10:55

Wasn't really talking about their AI defieciencies, just the straight out bug that happens over and over again for me.

Somehow, Claude (prior to his death) ran up into the air and on top of some nearby building, got killed, then ended up under ground. I was just lucky he had degeneration hexes on him, or he'd be safe and happy on that building indefinitely.

Here's how it happened:
Came in from the map, the party got wiped out (wasn't really trying to fight), and Claude ran ahead of the group and up into never never land somewhere in the sky under the earth. It seems to always relate to resurrection after having the entire party killed.

Qin Shi Huang · May 13, 2005, 01:25 PM // 13:25

Alesia doesn't tank, at least in the common sense of the term. But she has an overwelming urge to atack monsters, thereforebeing detected, and probably killed because I can't simply kill All the monsters that go on atacking her because she didn't stay on the back.
Definatelly, "protecting the healier hench" is a vital part of the strategy when going around with henchies. Despite the power of the firestorm, I lately take the archer instead ot the mage. The archer so far seems the brighter of all henches. she does what an archer is supposed to do, atack from range and if a monster comes near she takes a new position and tries to lure the monster away.
On the other hand, henches are most of the time better than Pick Up Groups. Most of the PUG's I participated in are dumb people who run, run, never wait for the party to get in formation and neither call targets, nor recognise a healer when they see one. Usually the healer forgets his job and people end up dying.
I got further on Althea's Ashes with henchies, than I got with human players....

Maybe henchies are not that smart because this way everybody would solo with them, who knows?..

Cheers.
--Qin.

Chavi · May 13, 2005, 06:52 PM // 18:52

Speaking of screenshots:

jdwoody · May 13, 2005, 08:17 PM // 20:17

I don't mind the henchmen too much and have used them many times to complete a group. The only time I have a real problem with them is if there are only one or two human players and you accidentally try to go down what looks like a path but instead hit an invisible wall the henchies will pin you down and you can't move. I've tried waiting a few minutes but they never move and you have to map out...

Jhetan Arrowblade · May 13, 2005, 10:00 PM // 22:00

After using then henchies as much as I have, I've learned some of the tricks to get around the stuck problems. On the one stuck behind the random object, I honestly usually miss them until we're about to wipe. But if you notice the henchman isn't dead when everyone else is, it's probably safe to run back looking for them.

But here's the whole point of the post : Solution to them running through the air and burrowing into mountains. Target yourself while you're rezzing, I haven't had them run off a single time if I have myself targetted(F default) when the rez shrine gets you if you have a few more people in the group, let them know too. It is hard for it to become a habit, but when I saw them running off every time I didn't do it, it caught on fast. If the problem was them floating before a rez, I've never had that problem.

nechronius · May 13, 2005, 10:30 PM // 22:30

I've actually had good luck with henchmen as well. The only real failure was trying to solo Lion's Arch. Everything was fine until we had to trudge through the poisonous swamp, in which case the NPCs displayed absolutely no sense of self-preservation and would stand in the poison until death.

At which point I promptly got into a party of 1 warrior and 5 rangers (including myself) and we proceeded to peck opponents to death. If I had brought my pet along for the adventure there would have been 5 pets. Oh well.

Eclair · May 13, 2005, 10:34 PM // 22:34

Okay, after playing with henchies a bit more, I have decided henchment are better than 25% of the players in the Crystal Desert. We almost beat Thirsty River in one try with 3 henchies 3 players and no real monk (we screwed up a pull on the final boss and ended up mobbing too omuch)

Before that game, we had 6 real players, and both of them died at the devourer/sand giant area...twice...

Honour_Shogun · May 14, 2005, 12:51 AM // 00:51

Having read all about hench-"intelligence" I have to say that it seems( and this is solely going from ascalon all the way to Yak'S Bend thru missions) they are more intelligent now. Now this could also be because I am playing a ranger/mesmer, and use chaos storm with glee on anything and everything I can, but an excellent example of how they can assess the situation was in the Nolani Mission. Found the graveyard, and was faced with about 25 level 10 spirits. Since I was only level 12, and the hench only 8, I worried that they might just aggro them, and tpk. But lo and behold, they did not rush headlong into battle, and I was able to, thru painstaking caution, pull groups of 2 and 3. All of a sudden, it was much easier to take them.
Another example, the bonus in the Ruins of Surmia(sp?) . I have been in PUGs where they rushed headlong at any opponent, and so that portion was ruined. But the hench stayed with me, did not go rushing at the enemy, and I was able to follow them and get the bonus.

That being said, I agree that there are some times when you wonder what school Alesia graduated from. Because if I, the human player, am taken down, and it is just her and the fighter, do not rez the mage! I am level 12, the mage is level 6 or level 8. I can tank a little, so rez me! Rez me!

I guess it also depends on how you approach things. Take working with both hench and PUGs with a grain of salt. Sometimes it can be a thing of beauty. Other times, well, don't feed the Dog chili

Animuz · May 14, 2005, 01:17 AM // 01:17

i didnt read all posts, but when u use henchies, i usually wont make it in a mission or quest. The henchmen, wich are lv20, dont use their skills properly. They only have the basic set of spells. The most annoying things is that the henchmen rush into a group and die, but you just wanted to shoot 1 enemy and let a few rush to us. Why cant there be an option to choose how henchmen react? defensive mode and attack mode?

Eclair · May 14, 2005, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Level 20 henchies have nice elite skills =)

Also, Stefan has this one move that seems to take off 20-25% of an enemie's life. My friend, a 20 W/Mo, can't figure out what he does, and he'd really like to.

ManadartheHealer · May 14, 2005, 03:32 AM // 03:32

Henchmen are real boneheads, but the sad thing is they are better than some players. They don't argue, they are obedient, and they always follow you and never run in the opposite direction until you can never find them again (except in some bugged instances)...

But, on the other hand, i have run into some really good and intelligent players. Persevere right until the end, and never give up. plus, they support their team. if you are part of this 3% or so of the GW players, I salute you!

spiritofcat · May 14, 2005, 03:50 AM // 03:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jhetan Arrowblade

After using then henchies as much as I have, I've learned some of the tricks to get around the stuck problems. On the one stuck behind the random object, I honestly usually miss them until we're about to wipe. But if you notice the henchman isn't dead when everyone else is, it's probably safe to run back looking for them.

But here's the whole point of the post : Solution to them running through the air and burrowing into mountains. Target yourself while you're rezzing, I haven't had them run off a single time if I have myself targetted(F default) when the rez shrine gets you if you have a few more people in the group, let them know too. It is hard for it to become a habit, but when I saw them running off every time I didn't do it, it caught on fast. If the problem was them floating before a rez, I've never had that problem.

I know what you mean about having something targeted when you res.
I had been fighting a big boss guy with my henchies, Alesia included, and when we all died, I still had the boss targeted. As soon as we respawned Alesia went running off after him again and vanished.

Galatea · May 14, 2005, 04:59 AM // 04:59

As much as I love Alesia the Healer, someone has got to teach her some sense.

Many many times, after our entire party dies and respawns, I count only FIVE green dots on my radar. "Where is Alesia?" I'll ask, clicking on her name, unable to see her on my map.

Turns out - she runs ahead without any of the party and by the time we reach her, we find a group of enemies swarmed around her dead body. I don't know what she is thinking - trying to be a hero and get revenge maybe.

Other times, I find that she takes a different route to the spot we died at, than the one the rest of the party is taking. She refuses to follow sometimes. I think she wishes she was leader.

TrueUltimaX · May 14, 2005, 10:08 PM // 22:08

Alesia is always the one that messes me up. She is usually always the one that glitches or gets stuck behind a pole. Yes, stuck behind the pole that tells you where you are going. Also, sometimes she just stands there, so when the rest of the team dies and she is the only one left, I have no choice but to restart. That annoys me like crazy. Also, today I experienced a the henchmen floating away glitch. Ugh.